Why don't black people like classical music?

[Jeebo]

I just L-O-O-V-V-E Beethoven, but his fifth symphony is not one of my favorites. I love his third, sixth, seventh, eighth and ninth symphonies, and all of his piano concertos, much more. Nevertheless, one of the local orchestras is going to perform the fifth symphony in a few days, so I got on YouTube and found a performance of that symphony by the Vienna Philharmonic. Watching and listening, I noticed something I often notice about classical music orchestras: THEY'RE ALL WHITE PEOPLE! Now I realize there are not a lot of black people in and around Vienna, but there are some. That city and country are not ONE HUNDRED PERCENT white. Yet, it seems that ALL of these European orchestras are one hundred percent white. Well, there are a few Asian people among them, but try to find a black or brown face. That goes for North American orchestras, too. Going to classical music concerts, as I often do, I see very few black people among the audiences too.

Is there some cultural reason why black people don't like classical music? Or are these orchestras practicing some kind of racism?

If I were the music director of one of these orchestras, I would launch a rigorous recruitment effort to try to get more black people into performing in these orchestras. This is something that has been bothering me for quite some time.

-- Ron

&list=RDq_kw904K2bw&start_radio=1

[hlthe2b]

1. Is it that they don't like it or hadn't had the opportunities to be exposed to it?

'Kinda like the blanket statement I constantly heard about black people not liking to ski (or in some circles, to hike or do any outdoor activities not linked to organized sports. Again, lack of opportunities, I'd bet.

[OC375]

2. Word

I didn't like any rap or hip-hip music until later in life. Just never really tried to like it, or hear it much over all the classic rock.

[biophile]

3. A better question is why aren't more people of color represented

In orchestras and at classical music venues?
It’s presumptive to assume black people don’t like classical music.
I don’t have the answers to either question- I just thought there might be a better way to frame the dilemma about why PoC are underrepresented in classical music as performers and among the audiences,

[Jeebo]

11. All right, I'll concede that.

My initial impression was that your question was not a better question, but simply the same question, rephrased. Then I thought about it some more and decided that my original question makes an assumption about the reason black people don't attend classical venues that your question does not make. So, your question is better phrased. I'll give you that. I should have thought about it more carefully before posting it, but I did dash it off just before leaving the house.

However, I don't agree that it's presumptive to assume black people don't like classical music. I made that statement based on observation, not on presumption. About three weeks ago I went to a classical music concert that included one of my favorites, the Sibelius fifth symphony. Wow, I love that symphony! Especially that incredibly beautiful second movement. I saw exactly two black faces there. One of them was one of the two ticket-takers at the entrance. The other was a young black woman in the audience. This was in an audience of several hundred people and an orchestra of several dozen musicians, in a midwestern college town that is about 15 percent black population. Look at the performance I posted above and try to find a black face in that orchestra or in the audience. I don't know how many black people there are in Vienna, but I'm sure it's a much higher percentage than were present in that concert hall.

Several posters in this thread said they find the question I posed offensive. They should find that societal condition offensive. All I am doing is calling attention to it. There is nothing offensive about noticing a sociological phenomenon and wondering what the reason for it is. And also please notice that I said that it bothers me, and that if I were in a position to do something about it, I would try.

In case anybody is wondering, I am a 76-year-old white man. Not that it matters.

-- Ron

[Easterncedar]

4. I wonder why you wouldn't see this as an offensive question

Very culturally tone deaf for a music enthusiast. Perhaps you might try to rephrase what I assume was a well-intended notion with something less obviously an us versus them point of view.

[Jeebo]

12. I find nothing offensive about my original question.

Several posters in this thread said they find the question I posed offensive. They should find that societal condition offensive. All I am doing is calling attention to it. There is nothing offensive about noticing a sociological phenomenon and wondering what the reason for it is. Please notice my more lengthy response #11 above.

-- Ron

[LoisB]

5. As a Black woman, I find this question offensive. Some of us do. I also love

ballet. Maybe you should not make generalized assumptions. We don't all listen to only rap and R&B.

[Bobstandard]

6. I do too

Quincy Jones studied and composed ‘classical music’ as did Mikes Davis, Herbie Hancock and others.

[ZDU]

9. Agreed.

Lois, I'm sorry for the insensitivity of the original poster.

[LoisB]

10. No need for an apology. I think they just should not have applied their personal

observation to "all".

[Jeebo]

13. My question is not offensive, but the phenomenon it refers to might be.

Several posters in this thread said they find the question I posed offensive. They should find that societal condition offensive. All I am doing is calling attention to it. There is nothing offensive about noticing a sociological phenomenon and wondering what the reason for it is. Please notice my more lengthy response #11 above.

-- Ron

[ZDU]

7. Damn. Insensitive.

Was this post meant to provoke?
I served in the Navy with a man who happened to be black and he loved classical music. So I find this original post to be offensive. That is all.

[Jeebo]

14. Where is the insensitivity? Point it out to me, please.

Several posters in this thread said they find the question I posed offensive. They should find that societal condition offensive. All I am doing is calling attention to it. There is nothing offensive about noticing a sociological phenomenon and wondering what the reason for it is. Please notice my more lengthy response #11 above.

-- Ron

[tonkatoy8888]

8. Okay, let's see

As someone who grew up and worked in classical music I have some ideas.

Cutbacks in public school music programs. Children who don't have parents who are interested in and play music were introduced to instrumental music in school band/orchestra programs. If you had real talent, you were encouraged and many schools provided private instruction as well as ensemble classes. Lots of my classmates in conservatory entered the study of an instrument through public school education...both black and white. Were the numbers of black classmates in proportion to the general population? No, but I think it was a little better than today.

Cost, and cost is subjective. If a young student pursues private lessons with a good teacher and accomplished professional it can be expensive. A decade ago, when my child was in high school and studying with a member of a major symphony orchestra lessons were about $60-$70 a pop. Expensive? Yes, but I saw many of his classmates' families spend much more on elite traveling baseball and AAU basketball teams. So, I guess we spend on what we find important.

Orchestras, which I know best, try everything they can to do effective outreach to minority communities with varying degrees of success.

I'm a white person, so I can't speak for minorities, but think about black kids and baseball. When I was a kid, everyone played baseball. By the time my son was a kid it was rare to see a black child on a baseball team he played on. They had all shifted to football and basketball. So maybe it's just partly what interests them.

What I can say with some certainty is that there is no hostility in orchestra management or among orchestra members to minority participation. In fact, they try very hard to increase numbers.

Why don't black kids and adults listen to classical/concert music? Probably the same reason not many white kids and families don't listen. It's a niche interest in America.

I don't understand it. Good music is good music. I have an interest in lots of music. A Brahms symphony is just as big a rush to me as the Beatles, Miles Davis, or a great bluegrass band. All can make me want to rock or bring me to tears.