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Cirsium

(3,663 posts)
132. "Bashing" vs accountability
Thu Feb 5, 2026, 07:43 PM
22 hrs ago

Calling out Schumer/Jeffries for what they are doing or failing to do is not “bashing” unless one assumes leadership is owed deference rather than scrutiny. Solidarity isn’t silence. In democratic politics, especially in moments of crisis, accountability is part of solidarity with the people who are harmed by policy choices.

You are using “solidarity” to mean alignment with leadership for tactical unity. I am using it to mean alignment with the people most affected. Those are not the same thing. When leadership positions diverge from justice or reality, solidarity with leadership can come at the expense of solidarity with the vulnerable.

Solidarity with whom is the real question here. Criticizing party leadership isn’t the same as attacking allies, especially when the criticism is about substance and consequences, not personalities. Movements don’t build power by suspending judgment indefinitely; they build it by being clear about what they stand for and who they stand with. If that clarity makes leadership uncomfortable, that’s not a failure of solidarity — it’s how accountability works.

Implicit in the question is: “Is now really the time?” History shows that this question is almost always asked when pressure is working. If criticism were truly irrelevant or unhelpful, it wouldn’t provoke this response.

Recommendations

6 members have recommended this reply (displayed in chronological order):

Well played. Permanut Yesterday #1
Absolutely! FalloutShelter Yesterday #14
What are we playing? Own the libs? Ilikepurple Yesterday #111
Please define critical discussion mcar 22 hrs ago #123
It's not this response. I imagined something closer to the discussion you and Cirsium had below. Ilikepurple 18 hrs ago #168
Excellent post. Orrex 5 hrs ago #207
Post removed Post removed 20 hrs ago #164
I agree LetMyPeopleVote 15 hrs ago #180
abolish ICE is not gonna happen and it is a bad look. there are some things I would like to see happen msongs Yesterday #2
OK, did Shumer and Jeffries meet that minimum? Escurumbele Yesterday #50
Seems to me they have mcar 22 hrs ago #124
Mahalo for Link, mcar... Turns out this is my fave Cha 17 hrs ago #177
Already bending on masks. we can do it 20 hrs ago #163
Nope mcar 20 hrs ago #166
Also stop the roving kidnap patrols sboatcar Yesterday #71
Well done. sheshe2 Yesterday #3
They're hiding under the couch hoping GOP unpopularity will propel them to majority. Won't work. 617Blue Yesterday #4
This message was self-deleted by its author Gore1FL Yesterday #12
People keep forgetting we have a MINORITY STATUS in Congress Just_Vote_Dem Yesterday #5
You're right. If we don't understand that, MineralMan Yesterday #7
The solution is not to roll over hoping for a belly scratch.. NT Gore1FL Yesterday #15
Sorry that doesn't hold water LearnedHand 22 hrs ago #136
When did "Republicans grind Congress to a halt" when they were out of power? lapucelle 4 hrs ago #214
Abolish ICE Prairie Gates Yesterday #6
Great Idea. Now...How do you do that in reality? MineralMan Yesterday #8
Abolish ICE Prairie Gates Yesterday #9
You already said that. It's a great idea. MineralMan Yesterday #11
Abolish ICE Prairie Gates Yesterday #13
So you got nothing. beaglelover Yesterday #20
Abolish ICE Prairie Gates Yesterday #22
In two words. MineralMan Yesterday #24
Abolish ICE Prairie Gates Yesterday #26
I want a pony. tritsofme Yesterday #64
Abolish ICE Prairie Gates Yesterday #66
I want TWO ponies! tritsofme Yesterday #84
Abolish ICE Prairie Gates Yesterday #94
huh? Cirsium 23 hrs ago #117
Imagine thinking antifascism is wanting a pony! Prairie Gates 22 hrs ago #139
When I started hearing that "pony" nonsense Cirsium 22 hrs ago #142
The same supposed realists now asking how many mask wearing fascists should be allowed Prairie Gates 22 hrs ago #145
Naming reality clearly Cirsium 22 hrs ago #152
Abolish ICE is a performative slogan, not an actual policy demand. tritsofme 7 hrs ago #191
I agree - slogans aren't policy Cirsium 6 hrs ago #198
+1 leftstreet 5 hrs ago #205
What I'm objecting to is the imposition of impossible demands aimed at Democratic politicians tritsofme 5 hrs ago #208
Thanks Cirsium 4 hrs ago #212
Not really. Just "pull the plug" basically. FoxNewsSucks Yesterday #41
Well, then they can scream that Schumer/Jeffries "caved" mcar 22 hrs ago #126
My idea? JustAnotherGen Yesterday #29
Use the Senate rules to stop ICE funding. Gore1FL Yesterday #19
Both of my Senators would vote that way. MineralMan Yesterday #23
No help from my Senators, unfortunately calguy Yesterday #90
So using your voice to influence legislators is okay or not? Ilikepurple Yesterday #103
Neither would. Josh Hawley and Eric Schmitt are into white nationalism. Gore1FL 22 hrs ago #149
+1 GOP poll numbers make them vulnerable leftstreet Yesterday #25
I'm going beyond that JustAnotherGen Yesterday #30
That's the bottom line Prairie Gates Yesterday #38
ICE has already been funded, it will continue to operate during a shutdown, and... W_HAMILTON Yesterday #33
probably, but instead of rolling belly up, Dems should MAKE tRump do that. FoxNewsSucks Yesterday #43
Who is "rolling belly up?" nt mcar 22 hrs ago #128
We do it when we have a trifect JustAnotherGen Yesterday #56
That's a nice idea, but a Sinema/Manchin/Fetterman/LIEbermann du jour FoxNewsSucks 20 hrs ago #161
So, They have money now and if we try to stop them from getting more... Gore1FL Yesterday #100
Vote against funding ICE for starters iemanja Yesterday #63
It starts with advocacy Cirsium Yesterday #77
In reality, the next president can just issue intheflow Yesterday #91
Missed the point, again, I see. Gore1FL Yesterday #10
No, I did not. I missed nothing. MineralMan Yesterday #18
So the intention is to gaslight? Gore1FL Yesterday #98
OK Cirsium 23 hrs ago #118
Is constantly bashing Schumer/Jeffries, mcar 22 hrs ago #129
"Bashing" vs accountability Cirsium 22 hrs ago #132
He did not miss the point. murielm99 Yesterday #79
I didn't know the point of DU was to cower in the corner. Gore1FL Yesterday #101
I'm a purist when it comes to fascist gangs kidnapping and murdering people in the street Prairie Gates 22 hrs ago #141
If I ignored your bashing, murielm99 18 hrs ago #170
WTF? Gore1FL 17 hrs ago #173
This is true. mcar 5 hrs ago #202
Sooooo when elected Dems want to grease the skids for FoxNewsSucks 20 hrs ago #162
Don't try to put words in my mouth murielm99 18 hrs ago #171
See the question marks? that's NOT FoxNewsSucks 17 hrs ago #174
I'm also sick of the "bashing" BS. It feels facile and counterproductive. Ilikepurple 16 hrs ago #178
Well said! beaglelover Yesterday #16
ICE hasn't been around that long, it was a fascist invention just like the debt ceiling, we can be the go along party or yaesu Yesterday #17
What sort of fighting are you talking about? MineralMan Yesterday #21
I would argue that there are "turning points" in between elections Ilikepurple Yesterday #115
This point would have been arguable decades ago FHRRK Yesterday #27
+1 leftstreet Yesterday #78
It's very frustrating. Quiet Em Yesterday #28
Dividing the Democratic Party is key. Targeting customized anti-Democratic attacks to fit. betsuni Yesterday #36
Bingo! mcar 22 hrs ago #130
This thread MorbidButterflyTat 18 hrs ago #172
Nonsense Cirsium Yesterday #31
"People can disagree with leadership and still be loyal Democrats." W_HAMILTON Yesterday #34
I strongly question that Cirsium Yesterday #40
As a progressive myself, i am cleaning up my own house here. W_HAMILTON Yesterday #44
Out of line Cirsium Yesterday #76
I'm not sure what cleaning house means other than resolving to silence progressive voices Ilikepurple 23 hrs ago #119
When people like myself were telling everyone the dangers of Trump back in 2016... W_HAMILTON 4 hrs ago #215
And again, everyone here did vote for those people. Scrivener7 22 hrs ago #148
Why do you question that? MineralMan Yesterday #46
Of course Cirsium Yesterday #80
"No single raindrop thinks it's responsible for the flood." W_HAMILTON Yesterday #104
Democrat Party? MineralMan Yesterday #97
Hardly Cirsium Yesterday #107
Yes, supporting and voting for the Democratic candidate is a loyalty test here. W_HAMILTON 4 hrs ago #216
There we go Cirsium 4 hrs ago #217
Agree--I'm so tired of being accused of not being a loyal Democrat if I disagree with leadership on occasion crimycarny Yesterday #54
Not having majorities in the House and Senate 3825-87867 Yesterday #93
FYI SocialDemocrat61 Yesterday #112
Yep Cirsium 7 hrs ago #186
You're telling Mineral Man to stop with the purity tests? mcar 22 hrs ago #131
Correct Cirsium 22 hrs ago #133
And those bashing Schumer/Jeffries aren't? mcar 22 hrs ago #134
I agree with that Cirsium 22 hrs ago #140
A. You invoked purity mcar 22 hrs ago #144
I know Cirsium 22 hrs ago #151
Thank you Cirsium! mcar 22 hrs ago #153
Thank you! Cirsium 22 hrs ago #154
Come on angrychair Yesterday #32
My answer has to do with only one thing - Elections. MineralMan Yesterday #35
Yes we need to vote D. We also need to inspire nonvoters to do so. we can do it Yesterday #39
No one person will meet 100% of any persons requirements. 1WorldHope Yesterday #52
"Plump bump" Seinan Sensei Yesterday #59
The full title is plump bump on my rump😎 1WorldHope Yesterday #68
And I don't think criticizing leadership on certain issues equates to wanting 100% crimycarny 21 hrs ago #160
"VOTE FOR DEMOCRATS! EVERY LAST F-ING TIME! NOTHING LESS WILL DO." I agree with that--- Jack Valentino 19 hrs ago #167
Understood Cirsium 6 hrs ago #199
If we do not win the elections, we do not have the majority MineralMan 5 hrs ago #200
Agreed! Cirsium 5 hrs ago #201
I do not know the factors that decide elections, frankly. MineralMan 5 hrs ago #204
Good post Cirsium 4 hrs ago #213
Abolish ICE we can do it Yesterday #37
Yeah, that Got Us So Far in 2016 and 2024 Cha Yesterday #42
These 2 are not meeting the moment, end of story dsp3000 Yesterday #45
I see. And I should be listening to you because... MineralMan Yesterday #47
The Author Didn't Say You Should. It's A Declarative, Not An Imperative. ColoringFool Yesterday #106
You made a post. The poster replied. How is their action more deserving of a snide dismissal than yours is? Scrivener7 22 hrs ago #135
Not even 95%! hay rick Yesterday #48
Just so. MineralMan Yesterday #49
Exactly. betsuni Yesterday #67
legislators Cirsium 7 hrs ago #187
Different constituents will have different messages. hay rick 7 hrs ago #192
Maybe Cirsium 6 hrs ago #195
This message was self-deleted by its author hadEnuf Yesterday #51
The only way to avoid disappointment is to lack principles. Renew Deal Yesterday #53
Politicians doing politics, governing. No! True saviors MAKE evil disappear with magic FIGHTING to MEET THE MOMENT. betsuni Yesterday #55
Some of the posts on here are damn nasty. MorbidButterflyTat 17 hrs ago #175
What I want to see. . . . BigDemVoter Yesterday #57
The Trick Is to Get That Majority in Congress. MineralMan Yesterday #69
Vote as one, yes Cirsium 7 hrs ago #189
THANK YOU! MorbidButterflyTat Yesterday #58
Most of us care about standing up to fascism iemanja Yesterday #60
Um. If 24 Republicans voted against a bill that only 7 Democrats voted for, there is no way it passed. Wiz Imp Yesterday #73
You're right iemanja Yesterday #99
Yeah. Don't vote. That'll show them. CountMyVote4Reality Yesterday #61
Who is saying don't vote? we can do it 20 hrs ago #165
No one Cirsium 7 hrs ago #190
Vote in the Democratic primaries and vote for Progressive Democratic candidates! Clouds Passing Yesterday #62
Please point to ANYONE saying they won't vote aocommunalpunch Yesterday #65
Anyone saying they won't vote is not here on DU. MineralMan Yesterday #70
Talk to them, then Cirsium 6 hrs ago #197
Insisting on political purity is what defeats Democratic candidates . love_katz Yesterday #72
This message was self-deleted by its author orangecrush Yesterday #74
Recommended. H2O Man Yesterday #75
Agree completely. cksmithy Yesterday #81
Elections have consequences. love_katz Yesterday #82
. Zelda_Orchid Yesterday #83
I don't berate some for being upset, especially the current situation with ICE. mdbl Yesterday #85
We're the minority party. Where's the advantage? QueerDuck Yesterday #95
Did you miss the part where the Senate can't pass the ICE portion without Democrats? mdbl Yesterday #113
Everyone has reasons for supporting or not supporting the politicians that are elected to represent them. Nanjeanne Yesterday #86
This is an awesome post. Scrivener7 22 hrs ago #137
Thanks. It's just how I feel. Nanjeanne 21 hrs ago #159
here's my deal quakerboy Yesterday #87
It's more about people being tired of those who think performative resistance Rob H. Yesterday #88
I am reminded of a line in Amiri Baraka's poem... NNadir Yesterday #89
They were never ours Cirsium 7 hrs ago #194
With respect to your last line, it's true for me. NNadir 5 hrs ago #210
Yes! You speak for me! They should just IGNORE that we're the MINORITY party... QueerDuck Yesterday #92
I think that may be the biggest straw man I've seen all week. Iggo Yesterday #96
Well, ya know, shit's not going to stir itself. Someone's gotta do it. Scrivener7 22 hrs ago #138
I agree. BannonsLiver Yesterday #102
How Is Agreeing To Masks Making "No Masks" "Possible To.... ColoringFool Yesterday #105
Bruce Springsteen - STREETS OF MINNEAPOLIS Emile Yesterday #108
Reality is sometimes hard to accept Progressive dog Yesterday #109
I Would Like A Positive Example Of When Compromise With Republicans Has Helped Achieve... ColoringFool Yesterday #110
A straw man. Nice. themaguffin Yesterday #114
As others have correctly pointed out, this is a straw man fallacy. De-rec. nt Celerity 23 hrs ago #116
How so? It seems we'll reasoned and right on target. QueerDuck 22 hrs ago #121
this part: Celerity 21 hrs ago #156
This message was self-deleted by its author QueerDuck 21 hrs ago #157
It's a truthful parody of the ridiculous complains and... QueerDuck 21 hrs ago #158
But is it a strawman? MorbidButterflyTat 17 hrs ago #176
It's neither. Only those who felt insecure or threatened when forced to look in the mirror... QueerDuck 11 hrs ago #181
Parody is always risky in a public discussion. MineralMan 4 hrs ago #211
Waiting for permission from the future Cirsium 22 hrs ago #120
Why aren't they impeaching Trump RIGHT NOW!!11 mcar 22 hrs ago #122
Apparently they are lazy and too old... QueerDuck 22 hrs ago #143
Spineless, Turd Wayers mcar 22 hrs ago #146
OMG! 🤣😂🤣😂😜 QueerDuck 11 hrs ago #182
I don't agree with Schumer and Jeffries 100% of the time SocialDemocrat61 22 hrs ago #125
RESCIND bdamomma 22 hrs ago #127
🪄🧙‍♂️🔮🧚‍♀️ It's so easy. Just do it. QueerDuck 22 hrs ago #147
I understand that the Democratic leadership markodochartaigh 22 hrs ago #150
I am regularly disappointed in both of those guys. MontanaMama 22 hrs ago #155
I'm still at a loss who this is directed at as obviously almost all of us vote Democrat Ilikepurple 18 hrs ago #169
Why post a divisive and insulting OP? PufPuf23 16 hrs ago #179
Yes, you're right. They should keep doing exactly what they're doing. Orrex 11 hrs ago #183
Thank you, Orrex. hamsterjill 9 hrs ago #184
Oh, my God. I love this. Scrivener7 8 hrs ago #185
I edited my reply to Orrex hamsterjill 7 hrs ago #193
Great post! Deserves a valentine heart 💝 Emile 7 hrs ago #188
K & R Emile 6 hrs ago #196
+1 leftstreet 5 hrs ago #206
The piling on by some is embarrassing. I'm hoping it's mostly trolls or bots Greybnk48 5 hrs ago #203
No trolls or bots Cirsium 3 hrs ago #218
My hope is that you are right (about this sort of bashing and disagreement being healthy discourse Greybnk48 3 hrs ago #219
I hear you Cirsium 2 hrs ago #220
I don't like it when they support Trump n GOP NAZIs Kid Berwyn 5 hrs ago #209
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