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hunter

(40,839 posts)
26. Batteries are a regressive tax on low income people...
Wed May 13, 2026, 04:02 PM
12 hrs ago

... the sole purpose of which is to assuage the guilt that affluent people feel for their environmentally destructive lifestyles.

Seriously, sometimes fascist Republicans owned by the fossil fuel industry can be right about a single issue for entirely the wrong reasons.

Here in the solar utopia of California we have some of the most expensive electricity in the developed world. Outside the municipal power districts (which historically have first dibs on hydroelectric power and storage) electricity costs 40 to 45 cents a kilowatt hour.

Electricity is similarly expensive in "green" Germany and Denmark.

Adding more batteries to California's electric grid will only increases the cost of our electricity further. Solar and wind power are EXPENSIVE. It's not the cost of solar panels and wind turbines alone, it's the cost of integrating them into a reliable electric grid. And no economically feasible amount of battery storage will eliminate the need for fossil fuel backup power.

Like it or not, solar and wind power cannot displace fossil fuels entirely, which is something we need to do.

Believing that solar and wind power will magically eliminate our dependence on fossil fuels is just an alternative form of climate change denial.

You can watch the behavior of California's electric grid here:

https://www.caiso.com/todays-outlook/supply

As I write this only 4% of my electricity is being generated by natural gas. Batteries are being charged at a rate of around 9 gigawatts.

The twin nuclear reactors at Diablo Canyon are generating a little over 2 gigawatts and they are running 24 hours a day.

The energy mix will change a lot when the sun goes down. You can check it out yourself.

Recommendations

3 members have recommended this reply (displayed in chronological order):

OMFG Chicagogrl1 13 hrs ago #1
MTG got ridiculed for saying the same thing... regnaD kciN 13 hrs ago #2
He's never seen the solar path lights they sell in the stores dalton99a 13 hrs ago #3
I have four different sets of them in my garden and by my door. niyad 13 hrs ago #11
Thanks for that. I don't have outside outlets and would like to have lights outside. Just hadn't thought it through Amaryllis 6 hrs ago #75
You are most welcome. There are so many kinds available. Have fun choosing! niyad 6 hrs ago #76
Costco has had some pretty ones in the past. AllyCat 4 hrs ago #86
Burgum wanting a rational discussion on subject he doesn't understand. txwhitedove 13 hrs ago #4
you can't understand something when your livelihood depends on ignorance DBoon 12 hrs ago #23
... eppur_se_muova 10 hrs ago #58
He understands it. He misinforms, gaslights, obfuscates, lies by design. LuvLoogie 10 hrs ago #61
Sinclair Lewis understood Burgum's ilk charliea 9 hrs ago #66
He cannot possibly be this stupid mcar 13 hrs ago #5
Of course he can! Why do you think the puppeteers chose him? niyad 13 hrs ago #7
He, like the rest of the minions, sold his soul to TSF mcar 13 hrs ago #9
You are assuming that they had souls to sell? niyad 13 hrs ago #12
Good point mcar 11 hrs ago #54
One of two things is true of Burgum meow2u3 13 hrs ago #6
He could be that dumb, and still helping to line the pockets of the niyad 13 hrs ago #8
Extraction, vulture capitalism's engine burns fossil fuel Magoo48 11 hrs ago #42
He seriously just might be that dumb Seinan Sensei 11 hrs ago #49
Both could be true... AZ8theist 1 hr ago #92
Actually, the belief that batteries are sustainable is... NNadir 13 hrs ago #10
What are suggesting instead? MadameButterfly 13 hrs ago #15
I willingly take some flak for my position that there is... NNadir 12 hrs ago #19
Nuclear has a role to play liberalgunwilltravel 12 hrs ago #22
I am an expert on this topic, having studied it for decades. NNadir 12 hrs ago #25
Nuclear is fine as part of the solution liberalgunwilltravel 12 hrs ago #28
I am always asked this question, day after day, week after week, month after month, year after year. NNadir 11 hrs ago #36
For the uninitiated (like me), DME stands for dimethyl ether. TheRickles 11 hrs ago #52
I do not support DME from dangerous natural gas. As is the case with hydrogen itself, exergy is destroyed under... NNadir 10 hrs ago #55
I heard that we can't produce the steel needed for SMRs anymore. SonOfNebanaube 6 hrs ago #79
The finest minds of the 21st century understand that nuclear energy is not the only form of sustainable energy. thought crime 4 hrs ago #84
Maybe nuclear? Mossfern 12 hrs ago #20
You need power liberalgunwilltravel 12 hrs ago #30
Thanks Mossfern 10 hrs ago #59
Hydrogen, whether generated by clean nuclear power or by so called "renewable energy" is a terrible idea as a... NNadir 11 hrs ago #41
Thank you Mossfern 10 hrs ago #60
Well the good thing about admitting one knows little - the excellent thing in fact - is that one's mind is open. NNadir 10 hrs ago #63
This message was self-deleted by its author MadameButterfly 13 hrs ago #16
I'm Sorry but what you say is not the whole story. liberalgunwilltravel 12 hrs ago #21
At Field Station Berlin we used lead-acid batteries in our powerhouse jmowreader 11 hrs ago #48
Hmm... the smell: would exposure be detrimental w all that lead or a short time there would prevent that electric_blue68 10 hrs ago #56
Once the lead is cast into plates and fixed into a cell it's no problem, so long as it stays there jmowreader 4 hrs ago #87
chemical batteries are only one type of battery lapfog_1 12 hrs ago #32
LFP batteries don't have cobalt (or even nickel) however. Disaffected 11 hrs ago #38
It's always something tomorrow. hunter 11 hrs ago #53
Fusion energy and the hydrogen economy are very iffy alright but, Disaffected 8 hrs ago #73
Magic in the sense that they would allow us to quit both fossil fuels and nuclear power. hunter 4 hrs ago #89
I don't think anyone is seriously claiming batteries will reach utopia, Disaffected 3 hrs ago #91
The Trump administration is trying to boost nuclear energy thought crime 4 hrs ago #88
I have spent decades in the primary scientific literature and as a result, I have very little patience for handwaving. NNadir 10 hrs ago #62
Good grief, I'll not waste time trying to respond to all your "points". Disaffected 8 hrs ago #68
I think we have talked about this before. I am hearing that there are companies that PatrickforB 11 hrs ago #46
In applications that are not sensitive to energy density, USAF Brat 10 hrs ago #57
Rs also like to say when there's no wind blowing KS Toronado 13 hrs ago #13
🤣🤣🤣 ultralite001 13 hrs ago #14
I had an experience several months ago with a MAGA about wind energy storage. wnylib 8 hrs ago #70
He know that.. he's Trumps jester. BradBo 13 hrs ago #17
Literally... BurnDoubt 13 hrs ago #18
This old girl would just say, it seems it can get complicated. Joinfortmill 12 hrs ago #24
Batteries are a regressive tax on low income people... hunter 12 hrs ago #26
LOL popsdenver 11 hrs ago #44
Hoover dam has never produced as much electricity in a single year... hunter 9 hrs ago #67
I guess popsdenver 8 hrs ago #69
The argument against renewable energy is an alternative form of climate change denial. thought crime 11 hrs ago #47
"the sole purpose of which is to assuage the guilt that affluent people feel for their environmentally destructive lifes DBoon 4 hrs ago #85
Doh! Dave Bowman 12 hrs ago #27
Well, batteries Manatee 12 hrs ago #29
Ouch! Chasstev365 12 hrs ago #31
My outdoor solar lights stay on all night. Are they possessed? twodogsbarking 12 hrs ago #33
The lengths these... relogic 12 hrs ago #34
Yes, and when the sun goes down there is no photosynthesis and the plants all die. dedl67 11 hrs ago #35
+1 dalton99a 11 hrs ago #40
BURGUM... littlemissmartypants 11 hrs ago #37
An overly simple idea Crawford 11 hrs ago #39
Enough with these "The gentleman..." swong19104 11 hrs ago #43
"Are you a fucking idiot?I love that. Buddyzbuddy 11 hrs ago #50
The same basic argument is made for wind jmowreader 11 hrs ago #45
I covered the absurdity of this argument previously, discussing the amount of cobalt required to cover a month of... NNadir 11 hrs ago #51
The Tesla 3 battery, the one "currently" manufactured Disaffected 5 hrs ago #83
Good one. Please explain this very novel and new concept to me. Thanks. efhmc 10 hrs ago #64
He is his boss's servant D_Master81 9 hrs ago #65
Although Solar Syastems produce NO POWER at night... WarGamer 8 hrs ago #71
That moment of "sunlight" exposed Burgum to be oasis 8 hrs ago #72
According to Bergum, solar is "intermittent" and not secure Renew Deal 7 hrs ago #74
They are going to complain that some other power source is interruptable during RockRaven 6 hrs ago #77
Genius that one is BillJoeBobBeauregard 6 hrs ago #78
just have to put in this reply and a response to the reply: orleans 6 hrs ago #80
Is there a Nobel Prize for stupidity? Permanut 6 hrs ago #81
For the next news flash - wind turbines stop generating when there is no wind! Aussie105 6 hrs ago #82
You could put solar panels near hydro dams and applegrove 3 hrs ago #90
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