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Men's Group
In reply to the discussion: Tony Porter Ted talk; A call to men. [View all]lumberjack_jeff
(33,224 posts)44. I appreciate your participation.
I'm also going to kind of deconstruct paragraph 2 as well, and I hope this doesn't sound like a pile-on, because my reaction is somewhat different from Warren D
I'm not picking up that there's anything fundamentally wrong with men. The point I got was that most men are fundamentally good and decent. How could they not be? You don't want your daughters to be reduced to sexual objects, or abused, any more than mothers do.
Is that the only metric that's important for a man to be considered fundamentally okay? (I know it's not - not consciously at least) But as a first reaction, it's worth examining; the first and most important value of a father is protecting their daughters perceived virtue.
That's my main issue with the video; the myriad problems with men are only issues to the extent that they manifest as insensitivity, disparagement and (too often) violence to women.
Maybe deal with the dominoes at the beginning rather than at the end. A guy who gets a poor education partly because of his incarcerated father, doesn't go to college which results in getting a poor paying job and frequent unemployment, which results in poverty for his family which causes marital stress which causes mutual IPV, which causes injury to her, which causes jail for him.
The paradigm "men suck" is the last domino which circles around to trip the first one. It's a self-propagating system.
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So straight up, honest question, Catherina: Looking at the videos, it seems geared in large part
Warren DeMontague
Jun 2012
#13
Anecdotally, it seems like there are some entrenched attitudes, for instance, in many AA communities
Warren DeMontague
Jun 2012
#17
Maybe the difference is, where some people see monolithic forces like culture, I see individuals.
Warren DeMontague
Jun 2012
#23
How about the young kids on the fence who don't even know they're on the fence?
Catherina
Jun 2012
#27
I'm trying to imagine myself into the situation you're putting out there, & drawing kind of a blank
Warren DeMontague
Jun 2012
#39
And I absolutely think the guy in the video whose neighbor was belting his son during a game of
Warren DeMontague
Jun 2012
#41
I'm curious as to the actual specifics of the incident or incidents you are talking about.
Warren DeMontague
Jun 2012
#24
So really, to you, this is about porn, and not so much about men being told not to express emotion.
Warren DeMontague
Jun 2012
#31
no. really it is not. it is so beyond that. but, then i am not surprised you get this. i will
seabeyond
Jun 2012
#32
Do you think that men enjoying looking at naked women is a "problem" that needs correcting?
Warren DeMontague
Jun 2012
#35
2 and 4 yr old and 10 and 12 yr old are "men" to you? i think this would be another example of what
seabeyond
Jun 2012
#36
I responded to that, upthread, although frankly your anecdote was non-linear and hard to understand.
Warren DeMontague
Jun 2012
#37