is there actually people who believe that all men are rapists and attracted to little girls

[lumberjack_jeff]

62. Point by point

Is your claim here that we are not a patriarchal culture?

No, but I think you're confused about what the patriarchy entails. The violence against women act (in which the sentence is determined based on the gender of the victim), the male only draft, the fact that 92% of workplace fatalities are men, the preferential treatment given to women in school are all dependent on one basic social principle: women's lives are more valuable, and that men are comparatively dispensible.

That's the patriarchy. Men make the decisions on how best to protect the women. Rape isn't sanctioned by the patriarchy and never was.

I start from we are in fact a patriarchal culture, this is a male dominated society. This is about as controversial to me as racism or homophobia.

I disagree, and looking at any meaningful statistic of collective social health, men are at the bottom of the list. If it's a male dominated society, it manifests itself in odd ways. Men get less education, go to jail, commit suicide, die on the job, are more likely to be unemployed, die of preventable causes and are victims of violence more often than women. Is the fact that blacks suffer all of the previous social problems relative to whites, evidence of their dominant role?

But my point is not "rape is acceptable behavior", my point is that rape is stunningly frequent and we should do something about that. One suggestion I have is that we should change the cultural norms for acceptable behavior with respect to women in public. Every time I try to get you all to understand why this would be a good idea, a lot of people here seem to think I am calling them rapists or equating overt sexual propositions with rape. Overt sexual propositions to complete strangers are RUDE, but they aren't rape. Is that clear? They are an invasive intrusion into somebody else's space, and are, in my opinion, appropriate only in circumstances where it is clearly understood that this is expected. The behavior is rude precisely because we have A HUGE PROBLEM WITH RAPE. I don't know how to get through to you all that the women receiving these uninvited advances CANNOT DETERMINE WHICH SORT OF MAN YOU ARE. In fact I give up.

My approach toward "doing something" about the crime of rape is identical to my approach toward doing something about bank robbery or murder. Support laws that inflict appropriate punishments on the perpetrators.

But to you that's obviously not enough. Maybe if I rend my garments, gnash my teeth loudly, and proclaim my culpability for the criminal behavior of others, stupid frat boys won't risk prison by having sex with drunk girls.

Keep it up men, this is the world you have made, no problem, nothing wrong, no need to change.

According to at least one study, the incidence of rape has declined 85% in the last 30 years.
http://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=913013

Is that "the world I have made"? If so, maybe a little credit is due.

One last point. In the men's group there won't be universal agreement on any issue. The above is my view, to which I am as entitled as you are to yours. It is not about doctrine, it is about what interests you.